Improve (and disable) rerouting

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    Anna Ronkainen

    A few examples:

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    Brandon Babcock

    I've had these lengthy re-routes and the ones that make no sense a few times and it can be quite frustrating. I was on the same thought that I don't recall that to always be the case - previously the K2 was very good at joining the route ahead in a logical way, rather than advising paths that are inconvenient and occasionally unsafe. 

    Hopefully something will fix that issue soon, though the disable re-routing request as been on, for what feels like, years now.

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    Mike F

    I read on one of the bike review sites that bike navigation re-routing is a difficult task. As HH take up many reported feature requests, it would appear that they are not able to do much with this one. (Although I guess Disable should be possible, but what would happen to the navigation in that case? I personally prefer it as it is and use the follow my nose navigation if I need to go off course until I realise that the K2 has picked up the route again.)

    I was on a ride the other day through a forest area and several of the tracks I planned on Komoot were not viable so I took other ones. The K2 re-routed me incredibly well with some of the tracks going a long way before turning onto another to get me back on route.

    One problem is though, that when you go off-route and it wants to take you back to where you left it, it often does a detour instead of just saying do a U-turn. This I have never understood. This also leads to the problem that you do not know if you’re being taken on a wild goose chase or actually being taken back the route further ahead. I sometimes stop and unlock the screen to move the route along to see where it’s going.

    The only customisation there is of - Pavement; Gravel; Trail - should allow you to pick multiple options. As I’m on an MTB Pavement & Gravel would be ok for me.

    The red-line issue was a bug and should have been solved:
    https://support.hammerhead.io/hc/en-us/community/posts/18949831228955-BUG-red-track-over-yellow-track

     

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    Anna Ronkainen

    Rerouting is by no means trivial, but simply reverting back to the original K2 algorithm would help a lot in my opinion. As for navigation cues while off route and rerouting disabled, obviously don’t show any until back on route. Irrelevant cues just make it more difficult to use the map, especially with the automap function on.

    The detours probably come from using a routing algorithm primarily intended for motor vehicles, also on a bike you can most of the time make a U-turn wherever you please instead of having to continue to the nearest intersection. Anyway I know how to make that U-turn without instructions, so if it’s a simple case of a missed turn, I would prefer waiting until after I have actually completed the U-turn to start suggesting a reroute back to the point where I left the planned route. Generally if I’m deviating from the route and just continuing straight ahead (or whatever), it probably means that I didn’t want to follow the route, so telling me how to turn back is just useless.

    I haven’t tried the latest release yet, but I guess “We fixed an issue that could prevent Karoo from completing reroutes if you’re far away from the route.” could indeed have addressed the excessive red lines. I don’t see anything else relevant in the release notes since my original post.

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    Mike F

    The point about only showing a U-turn is that you know it wants to go back to where you left the route. As you, I mainly leave the route on purpose (for whatever reason) and want the re-routing to route ahead. By showing detours back you often cannot see if you are going back or going forward to the next interception point. If going back to where you left the route was only u-turn you would know that and any other re-routing was going forward.

    The other post stated the problem had been reported, so presumably it is fixed or should be soon. The ride I mentioned didn’t have the issue nor did I have the loss of chevrons which was also introduced with the bug.

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    Anna Ronkainen

    (My earlier comment somehow got caught in the filter so trying again...)

    In the general case the jump from “reported” to “fixed” is quite a leap of faith, but it seems that the excessive red lines are indeed not present anymore in the latest firmware. Silly reroutes definitely still persist, though (will write a separate post about one of those).

    The U-turn reroutes are especially bothersome with the auto-map function on, since you can’t use a larger-scale map while a cue is being displayed (ok, you can zoom out manually, but the zoom level just gets reset every time the cue changes). Much of the time I’m riding on very familiar roads so I’m basically keeping the route active just to track distance remaining, but the way the reroute function behaves when I know which way I should be going does not exactly inspire confidence in the navigation functions when on a ride where I would actually need to rely on them even if circumstances make me have to deviate from the original plan.

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    Ali

    Hi All, this feature was released in recent update on June 13th
    https://www.hammerhead.io/blogs/change-logs/karoo-software-build-version-1-482-1861

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    Anna Ronkainen

    Actually this one wasn’t. The “disable” part yes, but the actual reroute function has just been getting worse since my original post, and this feature request was about improving it. While I can certainly live with the current state (with rerouting turned off for all applicable profiles), I do still think it would make a lot of sense to offer, say, a global option allowing you to choose between the current reroute algorithm (if somebody actually thinks it is worth keeping) and e.g. whatever was originally shipped with Karoo 2.

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    Anna Ronkainen

    In my experience, turning rerouting off does now turn it completely off, you get the “Off route” message and that’s it, until you are back on route. If you are going off route near a place where you’re supposed to make a turn, you might still get a yellow cue or two before the Karoo notices you’re off route though.

    Still, a more sensible rerouting algorithm would be nice as well.

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    Thomas Gruber

    As written in another post, I tested the new option and it worked for me as intended with disabling and re-enabling re-routing. But as you described, when re-routing is enabled, it took more than one try before the Karoo stopped trying to take me directly back to my original route by the shortest way and accepted that I just wanted to take the side road ahead, which would have then crossed my original route somewhere on the horizon. So the definition of what is a logical return to a route is certainly different on the Karoo than it is on a Wahoo or Garmin. That doesn't mean its wrong or bad, it's just different. I'm sure there are also many riders who prefer to reroute by the shortest way back to the original route. This is one of the difficulties with rerouting on a bike computer in my eyes, as the device still can't know why I left the route and how I want to be routed back on it. So I think the option to disable rerouting is the best solution to this dilemma. But an option between the shortest, the most convenient or the most logical way to get back to the original route (which sometimes works on my Garmin) would be a great next step on this issue.

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    Anna Ronkainen

    A bike computer offering reroutes that look like something you’d need to turn a car around yet somehow manage to use singletrack trails in the process (using the prefer asphalt option) is just objectively bad in my book.

    I guess my top 3 cases for going off route would be

    1. didn’t bother to plan mostly familiar parts of the route in detail and Komoot had different ideas about which way to go (usually not a problem since I know the route, except sometimes when I don’t know exactly when to transition to the part of the route I did want to take)

    2. I change my mind mid-ride and decide to take a shortcut or a longer way (again usually not a problem since I probably am familiar enough with the roads to make such a decision)

    3. a section of the original route is unusable because of construction, road layout changes, village party (an actual thing I encountered on unfamiliar roads a few weeks ago...), or whatever (this is the case where I probably would appreciate a reroute, and just going back to the original route is simply not an option)

    In none of these is taking the shortest way going back to the original route the correct answer. But yeah, for the simple missed turns the “Off route” notification works well enough and for the other cases I would probably just prefer to look at the map, so I guess just keeping rerouting turned off is good enough for me.

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